Names and titles

Oh how I regret adding le danois to my name because now for some reason lots of people seem to think that us my ame.

It is not.

Let's have a quick little primer. Last names are not really a thing here in England at this time. They sort of exist but are not important. You have the occasional clan name for Scotsman and things like that but generally your last name is more like a title. Miller, baker, smith, are examples of this in common folk. They have the name of their profession.

For lords their last name is really where they are from or what they rule. So sigfried would be referred to as sigfried of richmond. Baron sigfried is another way to refer to him if your familiar with him but baron richmond would be more appropriate.

Now let's talk about those lovely monikers like le danois. These are sort of life nick names given by people usually long after the person lived. They reflect a certain aspect of the persons personality, a physical characteristic or some great deed.
Think Charlemagne the great or aethelred the unready. Or some examples from our game, Stephen the greatish. So everything you call sigfried "baron le danois" or use le danois when refereing to him it's like calling stephan " loRd the greatish" or "king the unready". Le danois means the dane. It's because he is danish.


Upshot is, now that I put this here I will assume anyone who uses the name le danois for me is doing it on purpose and not out of ignorance and I will act in kind. Proper behaviour is a very important part of dark ages that should not be forgotten.

I will do the best I can on an OOC basis, but I really just want to play and have fun and not have to learn every nuance of medieval etiquette. Good news is since I don't know most peoples names IC, shouldn't be THAT hard to adapt to using first names.

Im not saying use first names. Im saying dont use monikers like Le danois, or The greatish, when you refer to people.

Use their name if you are close enough to them to do so, otherwise use their proper title.

Also perfectly ok to call someone by only the name their title is attached to in semi-formal talk.  Example, Sigfried could simply be called Richmond by anyone approaching or above his standing.

When in doubt My Lord and My Lady also work well.  Given the familiarity many of us are supposed to have with each other, I suggest name tags.

Surnames are very much a thing in 13th century England, depending on the line of the person being discussed. Some family lines which will eventually lead to the great noble houses have been established, some for over a century. It is simply the case that many Nobles are still choosing their own surnames to meet with a growing fashion within the Court. Many are appellations given by other nobles or even the rabble, many are names chosen by those to whom noble title is being given, while others are appellations being adopted by children to honor the father from whom they have inherited lands and title.

While it is by no means necessary for a noble to have a Surname in this time period, there are certainly a lot who do, mostly Earls (the de Beaumonts of Warwick and Leicester, the d'Aubigny family of Arundel, the de Veres of Oxford, etc). These are generally appellations given based on where the progenitors of these lines were from, but they were adopted by their progeny who embraced the names in court, and their progeny, becoming surnames.

A good rule of thumb is that when talking ABOUT someone, when they aren't around, using their surname is often acceptable - especially if they use it themselves. What isn't is addressing them personally by an appellation they do not themselves use. Richmond or Baron Richmond to describe Sigfried would be acceptable, as would The Baron of Richmond, or Baron Sigfriend, or His Excellency. If he weren't around, referring to him as Le Danois would be understood, if a tad bit disrespectful. Calling him to his face would be offensive.

Wow that is way more Medieval Etiquette lore then the player cares to learn, since I am here for fun. Maybe just try and tell people what to call you and we can do our best to comply I mean unless IC we aren’t for some reason.

That is the entire point of this post. Fedomer, Marius, and I all just gave several different names you could call Sigfried. This list is here. So from this point forward I am assuming that any name used is used for an IC reason.

You got it, the Dane.

Also, if you don't care about etiquette OOC, get the ability. That is what it's for.

Hey, Ill accept the dane from you; i mean you are pivotal to the praxis here.

I'll try my best, but yes if it is appropriate I could have or not have Etiquette with my PC.

Having no vampiric status or mortal standing I have it easy. Milord, Milady, Father, Your Grace, etc

If someone wants to be called something else they let you know and then you have that minor exception.